Westbourne
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Hey, business besties. Welcome back to the female founder world podcast. I'm Jasmine. I'm the host of the show. And today I'm chatting with the founder of Westbourne, Camilla Marcus, Camilla, welcome to the show.
You are now entering female founder world with your host, Jasmine
Garnsworthy.
Thank you so much for having me. I've been excited. How Westbourne to people? What's your go to? We are trying to bring the biodiversity of regenerative farms to every.
home and kitchen and grocery store and beyond. We are one of the first regenerative brands really thinking about transforming the future of food for our generation. Amazing. How did you get into this business? You started in 2018, right? No, I started the products in 2022. We had a restaurant before that in New York in Soho.
I'm a originally trained chef spent my life in kitchens, cooking, developing restaurants. And I think as I really started to go, I'm from Los Angeles, born and raised.
I grew up in this bubble where we lived in [00:01:00] harmony with nature. That's just how you do it here in LA. And it was this earlier, I feel exactly. And I think getting into professional kitchens and realizing that there was this huge disconnect from what was happening on the farm. And then what was coming onto your plate or into your home, especially when it comes to the next generation of farming practices.
And so I think working through supply chains and developing restaurants for some of the most amazing people in the industry, but realizing, again, there was just such This disconnect and seeing all my friends be obsessed with what shoes they're wearing and, thinking about vegan leather and they're really proud about their clean formulation skincare and, refillables and no plastic packaging and compostable, slip bags.
And yet you'd go to their homes, look in their pantry, what they're buying in the grocery store and it didn't reflect those same values. And so I think for me, it was that rise of conscious capitalism and seeing our generation really change these. old and massive industries, and yet food fell, a decade behind, if not [00:02:00] more.
In a really practical sense, like what does that actually mean for someone who's going out there and like sourcing produce and creating, eventually creating a product? How do you do that? I think you start at the source, I think similar to anything, right? You're making clean skincare.
You have to think about botanicals versus chemicals. Yeah. I think similarly in food, it's about the farming practices. So contacting and really centering our products around farms that are re nourishing the soil, thinking about carbon capture and really trying to nourish the soil so that it can bear fruit right next year or the year after and the decades.
Further, and what you get out of that is a much higher nutritional, much higher nutritional produce that's better for you and better for the earth. I bet it tastes a thousand percent. You know what? This is a complaint that all of my Australian friends have about food in the US. I've lived here for 10 years.
Love America. Love living in New York. The food tastes like shit. Nothing has any flavor. You haven't come to [00:03:00] my kitchen yet. I have not been to your kitchen. Look, I think it's about, again, shopping at local, shopping at your local farmer's market when you're in the grocery store, looking for regenerative brands.
There's so many that you can buy online. Obviously we're in like the DTC world across all industries. There's so many regenerative brands and farms that will sell directly even to a regular consumer. So even just starting there, and I always say to people, Don't be worried about, solving the climate crisis tomorrow with everything.
Take one step. If every single person in America decided they would once a day take one step, cut out plastic in one way, right? Change your toilet paper to bamboo, shop at your local farmer's market once a week. Think about one thing. Don't bring a plastic bag, back from the grocery store, bring a tote.
One thing here and there, you start to get addicted and it does snowball, but even if you stuck to that one thing, if every single person did that, think about the collective impact. It's massive. So I think we also come, I see a lot [00:04:00] of people feeling so daunted of has to be all or nothing and I'm very anti that approach.
I feel like you've got to meet people where they are and it can just be that one thing. Start with one step. I love that message. So you started the restaurant in 2018 and then in 2020 ended up closing the restaurant and speeding up the process of launching your first product, which I know was always on the pipeline, but you wanted to obviously get that out sooner.
So I'm going to talk about the product launch in a second, but something that I want to learn a little bit more about, you had actually dipped your toe in the water of products because you had a collaboration with Glossier when you were running the restaurant that was a product based collab.
What was that and how did that happen? I still look at that. It was one of the most fun periods in my career. So we had a really close relationship with Glossier, an old friend from way before the company was started. Sort of one of their early employees. Again, Kismet, they had moved their headquarters to their big office that's now on, in West Soho from East Soho.
Happen to be two blocks from the restaurant [00:05:00] and at the time now there's a lot of restaurants in that area when we opened there was almost none And so we became their de facto cafeteria if you will and you know Their food partner in a lot of different ways, and they'd said, can you come over the office tomorrow?
I said sure I walked in they said launching berry bomb com I think it had been a while since they had done a new flavor and obviously at the time The bombs were their biggest seller And they said, because it's food based, we want to do a product that we can ship around the country. We want you to create something with a recipe.
And by the way, we got six, I think it was something like six weeks to do it. And I said, game on. I'm also the person that's like the crazier, the better. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Under this pressure. Totally. I was like, let's go. So I come back to the restaurant. I'm like, we're going to ship hundreds of this product.
We're going to develop it. We're going to make it and we're going to figure it out. And so we did a. Barry compote for them in a really beautiful jar. And it was just so fun. And I think that's when I realized, look, we also can touch so many more people out of the four walls of a restaurant. And [00:06:00] I love product development.
I'm so that like early beta tester. I love giving feedback, love packaging. I just, I'm very physical textile. I think that's very much like the chef side of me. That's when it really started to roll. We started experimenting with a bunch of different kinds of products in the restaurant.
Snacks and, different to go items, but that was really that aha moment for us. When you launched officially your products in 2022, what did you launch with?
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So our hero product to begin is it's on our table is our avocado oil. And that's what you're going for, I think as well, right? Yeah.
We're about to expand big time next year, but we felt I felt like it was, [00:08:00] A big centerpiece of right, you use cooking oil almost every day. It's something that can go on your tabletop on your countertop. It's really out and present versus being something that's hidden in your pantry, right?
If I come over to your house. Which is also a new phenomenon that wasn't really the case. I would say over 10 years ago Our generation loves the like beautiful stand by the stove showing, you know Your beautiful pepper mill and what kind of salt you're using and it says something about you. It is very much.
I think a Personal style moment in the home Which again, in our parents generation, it was very much everything was put away. And so I think for me, it was a way to be a core staple in your cooking life. And also I've just been a big believer in avocado oil for a long time. And in the regenerative space, what a lot of people don't know is avocado trees are very often co planted with coffee and chocolate.
It feeds really special nutrients in the soil and then provides the right kind of shade. And when you think about. the regenerative movement, a lot of [00:09:00] large scale regenerative agricultural plots and businesses started in coffee and chocolate and early brands started in coffee and chocolate because they're obviously one of the top two crops globally.
So avocados are present on these, large scale regenerative farms, but it's not their prime time crop, right?
It's just part of the ecosystem. And that's exactly our mission is how do we intercept the other amazing crops that they're growing as part of this integrated ecosystem and create a high demand. High velocity, everyday product that you would use anyway. Not trying to change anyone's behavior, trying to meet you where you are and create something that's flavor for it.
Obviously, first and foremost, it has to taste better than what's on the market. And then again, something that's a lot more sustainable, better for the earth and better for your health. So since launching a couple of years ago, I'm really curious about like how your customers are finding you, how they found you in those early years and how they find you now. I do think some of our built in community really came [00:10:00] from the restaurant days. There's a lot of people, I think, in an interesting way, COVID was this mass dispersion, right?
Everyone moved. And I think that sort of sent our, friend group, if you will, from the restaurant kind of all over the country, guys still run into people or we get DMs from people, love the restaurant, love the products, I live in Texas now, I live in Colorado now. So even though we were still, very localized and obviously so New York centric.
There was this interesting dispersion that I think naturally happened after COVID. I think it's all the ways I think social recommendations, seeing it at a friend's house. I think press, I think in food press still does certain publications. I do think really moved the needle.
That's interesting. Why do you think food makes a difference? I think there is a little bit of a sense of needing I think it's the same reason why people still care about what critics say about restaurants, right? Yeah, you might ask a friend, but you're probably asking a friend who has been in restaurants, worked in restaurants, or has some sort of food background.
You're [00:11:00] not just like asking a random friend most often. I don't know. There is this like hierarchy, I guess I would say, of you want that stamp of approval. And I would bet, even if you ask your friend, you're cross checking it with a couple of critic sites or things online that are like, supposed to be experts in this space.
I do think there's something about that. And we see it a lot. We had an amazing article January after we launched the highly recommended Bon Appetit drove crazy banana sales. And it was something we had been talking to them for a long time. And it was such a glowing review of our extra virgin avocado oil.
And. It really just went gangbusters. So I do think, I don't think all media, but I do think there's a couple, and I don't even know if it's necessarily just the publication. I think there are certain columns, right? Same as strategist. Yeah. If you're getting something for your baby. You're going to strategists.
You're going to see the five strollers that they recommend. You'll probably pick one Yeah, you might cross reference that with three mom friends [00:12:00] that you trust. Yeah, but I do think in a similar way There's just a couple of those I think in the food world that really do catapult you a little bit more.
That's so helpful to pull out the specific, like what the column is, what the publication is. Florence Fabrikant, front burner, come on. Like she also drives, and again, think about it. She's only choosing a very select amount in the year, right? She doesn't just write all the time. She's known for being super discerning, very fair.
very objective. So again, I think similar to strategists, right? Like it is, I say savage in a good way. It's so discerning that trust with their readers instead of being like, I'm going to recommend a product, 10 products every day. And so I can get my products because it was gifted, right? It's a thousand percent.
And I think there are a couple of those that really ring true and I think hold their community really tight.
How are you thinking now about your DTC business versus wholesale? Because wholesale is obviously, [00:13:00] particularly in food, it's big. Yeah. It's been interesting over the past couple years to see people waking up to that. Food, I think, again, unlike other industries, you buy in a basket with other brands out in the world.
I don't think the DTC is, it doesn't mean it can't be, A contributor, but I just don't think it's the way that like I'm buying a denim jacket. I'm going directly to that website when I'm buying food products. I'm in the grocery store. I'm out at, a small high street boutique store. I just think the vast majority of Americans.
Shop food in a basket with other brands in just such a different way than other industries. Totally. That said, I think it's a really important discovery.
It's really important for discovery. It's important for your loyalists. It's important for storytelling. It is important for information. I think people also buy stuff in the grocery store. Go to the website to learn more. But food, the focus of the business has to be on wholesale. Yeah. You've you've got a pretty big retail launch coming up. [00:14:00] You mentioned it's very exciting. This is a very big, crazy fall for us. What's happening, what you can share and how the opportunity came about.
Yeah. So we, like I would imagine most food brands, it's very inside baseball. That's so much of our food system and how distribution works. I'm sure it's the same with Sephora and again, in the beauty world, even in retail, right? There's it's very hub and spoke. There's a couple market makers, you really have to get to them.
And there's. A lot of agencies that you have to use to go there. Very few things happen really directly. So we've been working with a grocery broker and they helped us secure our biggest retail launch, which is 163 stores. We're launching with Fresh Market, which we are so excited about. It's really big.
We went from, we're lucky our first retail partner was Air1. They've been really amazing to us. I think there are about 10 or 12 stores now in LA. Actually, it's wild. And I'm excited. No one's ever asked me publicly, [00:15:00] but I'm excited to share because it is one of those things where you're like, no, that can't be real.
And I swear it is. You listen to some podcasts and interviews and you're like, no way. I call BS on that. We literally had just launched the avocado oil. We did a big event at my house with Ron Finley and. About three weeks later, we literally got a DM from Erwan and remember this is when they only had four stores They've tripled in the last two years.
They took on a big investment. They're probably gonna go national very excited for that But you know is quote unquote back in the day when they did things I think a little more guerrilla marketing and so they DM'd and said would you consider You know, partnering with us. And I said like obviously I shop at everyone all the time.
I'm from LA and I wrote them this love letter. I said, but we have no clue what we're doing with wholesale. So full disclosure, we're going to mess up. We're going to change the product. In fact, we launched with a seven 50 milliliter bottle, what we now call our house bottle. I thought people would want value, right?
Bigger size. Yeah, the price might be more than something like that, I'm also a chef. Obviously I use an enormous amount. [00:16:00] Totally. I was wrong. We learned through Erwan and they've been good to us. We've really changed the skews. We've changed the formats. We've changed the labels.
They've been amazing, but it was funny because we were really like, we totally do, but we're going to F up, and I just want to be very clear, like we're not going to be ready. And as long as you're willing to go through the growing pains, We're stoked and we're going to invest in this channel.
We do a lot of demos. Like I said, I shop there all the time, but it was wild. I think getting a retailer through DM is like, yeah, will normally happen. So the lesson out of that was basically with retail it's sometimes it's better to have a smaller product at a lower price. So people feel it's more accessible to try it. Is that the lesson? We had actually two lessons concurrently, which was really interesting. So one was the bottle. I think it's really hard.
And I think you learn this in beauty, right? The reason that lip gloss is really popular is because it's, a certain price point. You're okay, I'll dip my toe in with this brand. I've never heard of them [00:17:00] before. It's not a high investment or high performance product. You're okay, I'll see what they're about.
Similarly, I think this sticker shock of, a 40 entry point to say, I'm not even sure I like this brand. It's just too high. Yeah. So one, it was getting a product that was 20 or less as the first one. And then two is interesting. cooking oil, which is out the later colored one. We originally called it refined because that is what happens.
It's refined through a process. What we realized again through some air one feedback and some testing and demos was that word refined and oil. You think of an oil refinery, which is actually the opposite of sustainability and our mission. And it's funny how those words mind played for people.
And so we changed it to a hundred percent pure. And what was interesting is the extra virgin, which is more expensive. Even in the larger bottle, it clips sales to X over the pure. When we switch the name and we change the format of the bottle to be smaller, it [00:18:00] completely switched within two weeks.
Interesting. Drastically. Wow. Wild. I want to ask you about money. And funding.
You've, I feel like you've started to like, essentially products that are really expensive, a restaurant. And then, this food based CPT business, which are the two really expensive things to start. How did you fund it in the beginning when you were doing the restaurant and then when you evolved into the products?
So restaurant family and friends, and I will say I, so I'm also a pretty active angel investor, so I love talking about money. I think it is something we shouldn't be so hush about. I think it's really interesting in restaurants. I still get asked a lot by friends in the industry or people starting in it.
Like how do you finance it? It's really hard because restaurants are so different. It's more like an annuity. It's much more about like annual distributions. It doesn't have venture returns. And frankly, most people want to invest in a restaurant because. They want it to be their clubhouse, right?
They want it to be the place they eat at. They can get a reservation at any time. They flex to their friends. Like it's, I guess it can't compare to a sports team, but a little bit, in [00:19:00] that sense of, sports teams obviously have a huge rainbow at the end of the, the end of it, if you do it well.
But I do think, I always say to people, start with your network, start with your community. If you're a chef opening up a restaurant, I would say, if you've worked as a private chef, contact clients, ask them if each will, contribute a little bit. They know your work, they know your food, they're going to be excited.
Like it has to be personal. Even like crowdfunding to be honest I think fits restaurants much more than a lot of other businesses. So friends and family and then you know, we were very fortunate when We launched the products, air one we had quote unquote got on the hook We ended up joining an accelerator program, which I highly recommend.
I know some founders have had mixed, experiences. I think it depends on the accelerator. It depends on your business. But we partnered up with SOSB. They're the largest global climate investors. It's like honestly having Captain Planet, amazing on speed dial. They're amazing. And it was interesting, again, a Kismet, I don't like to use luck, but I do [00:20:00] think there's a universal cosmic from LA.
I totally believe in that stuff. The last thing I want to ask you is whether you take a paycheck out of the business yet. A lot of the families I speak to are not. I, so we are also, again, I think there's something about having a baby, at least in my life, my astrologer, who I was telling you a little bit about We always say it's just like when it rains, it pours.
So I'm five weeks postpartum. We are literally in the process of closing our seed round right now. I've been on and off with investors basically through my entire delivery and postpartum. And now I will be taking a paycheck. Amazing. What a great note to end. Look, you have to, I think you have to take it at some point.
I think it's super important that the founder is valued, but I also understand Look, we all have to get to the place in our businesses where it makes sense to, right? And I also think it helps you look at your team and say, okay, what would I pay someone to be doing what I'm doing? And vice versa, is there a way to build the team around me so [00:21:00] I can take that paycheck?
Yeah. And be able to build a team that makes sense so that it can do that. Yeah. And also that it's sustainable and you can do this for the long term because it's, it is a long term game. Camilla, thank you so much for coming on the show. We're going to do a very quick part two that'll drop on Wednesday with some of your resource recommendations, but congratulations on everything you built.
Thank you. Thank you for having me and same to you.
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